Psychology of Kink: Episode 5 Transcript

00:00:36:16 - 00:01:06:01
Speaker 1
Welcome back to the Psychology of King. I am joined by Goddess Victoria, Sway and Mistress Madeleine Prior. And tonight we are at Please Educated Pleasure Shop in New York City, located at 635 Fifth Avenue. In this episode we are going to be discussing kink play and long term relationships and what kink can add to long term commitment. Long term relationships often struggle not with love, but with predictable desire.

00:01:06:03 - 00:01:37:15
Speaker 1
Kink can function as a form of relationship inoculation, a structured disruption that preserves intimacy, externalized desire, and creates shared meaning. So let's get into how inserting kink into a preexisting dynamic can spice things up. Madeline, I know you have an entire course on this, so, Mistress Madeline, tell us a little bit about how kink, as a form of adult play can do so much to invigorate a relationship.

00:01:37:16 - 00:02:02:00
Speaker 2
Obviously, I am a believer in this method, and I have to give a little shout out to my course bonded that I teach with mistress who you know, and it is built on that idea that kink can pull you out of a rut, pull you out of the sort of monotony that can happen in long term relationships, and introduce you to something new.

00:02:02:01 - 00:02:25:19
Speaker 2
It can introduce you to your partner in a completely new way. It can introduce you to a new aspect of your partner, perhaps, that you've never met. And so in this way, it allows our relationships to evolve and to recapture that dynamism that you felt in the beginning where everything was new or like the way that he breathed and ate his breakfast was so new.

00:02:25:21 - 00:02:57:03
Speaker 2
You can start to reintroduce novelty and even into a relationship that you've been in for years, and that is in bonded what we are doing. We are teaching kink 101 two couples. Here's what I notice for couples the barrier to entry, the barrier to trying something new, something novel, something risky, something foreign can be higher than if you're in a brand new partnership and everything is new and you're feeling kind of confident and crazy.

00:02:57:05 - 00:03:25:09
Speaker 2
And so I do often encourage couples who are going into this space, like, don't get discouraged if it falls flat the first couple of times, because once you start to push and break through and find your access points, that builds the confidence to keep you on the journey to find more access points. We have more success stories than I could name, but I will give one little tiny anecdote.

00:03:25:10 - 00:04:02:10
Speaker 2
There was a couple who came in to the course who decided that they were not actually kinky. They came into the course because they were like, maybe we are kinky. And they realized that they're actually quite vanilla in the ways that they wanted to play, but that kink gave them the language to describe their desires in ways they didn't have before that containment, especially coming from the male partner to the female, actually gave him a level of dominance and leadership in their relationship that mega strengthened their polarity.

00:04:02:10 - 00:04:33:17
Speaker 2
That changed the game for them. And so even if you don't come into kink because you love being tied up and you secretly want to be slapped around, and in these intense situations, you might find that it gives you the tools simply to right the polarity in your relationship, or it gives you the tools to communicate in a new way, or it gives you the 2% more aggression that you need to really take your partner.

00:04:33:19 - 00:04:45:22
Speaker 2
And that's enough. And so it is a wild jungle of a world. And the point of going into it as a couple is you, you take what works for you. Yeah.

00:04:45:23 - 00:04:52:02
Speaker 1
Amazing goddess Victoria, how do you see kink showing up in longer term dynamics?

00:04:52:08 - 00:05:18:10
Speaker 3
Two things that kind of build on what you said. The first thing is many relationships. It's hard for people. They have so much to risk to become vulnerable. And so then they stop being vulnerable because they have this whole life and kids and, you know, their relationship and their family and and they don't want to risk this structure that they have.

00:05:18:11 - 00:05:52:23
Speaker 3
So they, they don't be they don't get vulnerable. They don't take risks. They don't. And then they lose polarity because nobody is expressing themselves. They're not being authentic. So when you introduce kink, people start to have opportunities to be authentic, to express things. And it teaches them that it is okay to take some risks and they're not going to lose all of these things.

00:05:52:23 - 00:06:29:03
Speaker 3
But if you don't first acknowledge that there is risk and teach ways to repair when things go wrong, the couples aren't going to dive into that. And then the second part that you touched on, which is polarity in relationships, people tend to lose their polarity. And then that's when they lose their attraction and they lose their magic. And so kink inherently, you have, you know, somebody is the perpetrator and somebody is a victim.

00:06:29:06 - 00:06:42:19
Speaker 3
You know, somebody is this. And so that you start to establish that polarity again and they get to play that out and their scenes, and then that brings polarity into their relationship, which then builds the magic.

00:06:42:21 - 00:06:45:20
Speaker 1
So I'm excited to.

00:06:45:22 - 00:06:47:16
Speaker 4
Talk about this.

00:06:47:18 - 00:06:48:09
Speaker 1
This is fun.

00:06:48:10 - 00:07:31:11
Speaker 2
I want to say one thing about polarity and just kind of to build that, because couples and long term relationships are often a meshing that is part of natural process. It's a natural process. There is so much value in understanding and acknowledge your separateness from your partner. And that's the reason that these roles are so effective, because inherently, because of the polarity in kink, you have to acknowledge the separateness, the Dom, the sub, the perpetrator, the victim, mommy child, whatever those roles are, you are creating two of them.

00:07:31:13 - 00:07:41:03
Speaker 2
And so you're back into being a separate sovereign being. And between those two beings on those two poles, that's where the arrows gets to exist.

00:07:41:05 - 00:08:05:22
Speaker 1
So so gorgeous. Let's talk about entry points for those curious but intimidated. Of course, amazing master classes out there like bonded. When couples come to you or coaching clients, whoever it might be. Where do we even begin? Goddess Victoria, can you think of some accessible entry points that you typically recommend people?

00:08:06:03 - 00:08:17:12
Speaker 3
I'll even tell people you start with something as simple as I want to be devoured and or I'm going to devour you. And.

00:08:17:14 - 00:08:42:12
Speaker 3
The succubus or the the, you know, daddy, who's going to take care so you can keep it simple as a way to start to get comfortable with a little bit of of polarity. You don't have to start with, I'm going to tie you up and electrocute you. And, you know, whatever you.

00:08:42:14 - 00:08:45:22
Speaker 4
Can, you can. You don't have to.

00:08:45:23 - 00:08:46:19
Speaker 3
It happens.

00:08:46:22 - 00:08:48:02
Speaker 4
But but.

00:08:48:07 - 00:08:52:10
Speaker 3
You know, there are things that are more accessible for people.

00:08:52:11 - 00:08:58:14
Speaker 1
Yeah. Mistress Madeline, what do you see specifically within your work, your masterclass. What's the first lesson?

00:08:58:15 - 00:09:00:02
Speaker 4
Yeah.

00:09:00:04 - 00:09:44:17
Speaker 2
The first lesson is understanding what Adam is and what a sub is, and understanding the two roles and why they're different. The piece that we explain in a previous episode around the Dom being energy and attention out the sub being energy and attention in is typically quite helpful, right? But when I'm working with people who are brand new, freshly fresh, I recommend going to a class seeking out a professional workshops, play parties, being in spaces where you can learn with a third party or with other people, often takes the pressure off of the intimate moment in your bedroom, right where the stakes can feel high.

00:09:44:19 - 00:10:13:00
Speaker 2
Because ultimately this is play and role play. Trying on a new role with the person who maybe is known you for years, maybe decades can feel a little kooky. It can feel a little like, okay, you obviously know that I'm your wife and the mother of your children, right? And so it's going to be a little hard to be your sadistic employer who is so pissed that you're late to work.

00:10:13:02 - 00:10:38:15
Speaker 2
And so it can be helpful to have those first moments of exploring scene play in these pressures off environments where it's meant to workshop in. I love workshops. If you are in a city that has great in-person stuff, go find it. We're in New York. I'm sure you can share if there are many. Yeah, and and there's a lot of great stuff online.

00:10:38:21 - 00:10:41:06
Speaker 2
Bonded is online, but there are many courses online.

00:10:41:07 - 00:11:06:10
Speaker 1
Yeah, fantastic. And let's talk a little bit about what happens after the scene. Some people yes are in 24 over seven dynamics. And those roles are maintained for the relationship for other people can can be some can be a scene. How do people unwind? We can get a little bit into aftercare or transitions. What's coming up for either of you?

00:11:06:12 - 00:11:09:05
Speaker 3
I mean I always end with, how do you feel?

00:11:09:07 - 00:11:10:14
Speaker 1
It's a great question.

00:11:10:16 - 00:11:14:19
Speaker 3
How do you feel? What was that like?

00:11:14:21 - 00:11:29:11
Speaker 3
And I'm always trying, you know what? Somebody has gone deep into subspace getting them to start to wake up and know how they feel and in touch with.

00:11:29:13 - 00:11:55:05
Speaker 3
Reality a little bit more is, is is part of the process as a Dom, for me, just being grounded and being there and and giving them that, you know, they're going to regulate through how I'm acting and responding. And so giving them something to ground to while they process what they just experienced is kind of important.

00:11:55:06 - 00:11:57:08
Speaker 4
Beautiful. Absolutely.

00:11:57:10 - 00:11:59:11
Speaker 1
How about for your mistress, Madeline?

00:11:59:13 - 00:12:23:19
Speaker 2
I use ritual to close a scene, and it's for me and the sub. It's for us both. But I do the same thing at the end of every scene, which is I will give my sub physical touch, maybe like a hand on the heart. Maybe I'm holding them from kind hand on the forehead. But I'm creating physical containment, calming their body down once I've felt them land.

00:12:23:19 - 00:12:46:07
Speaker 2
And usually you can feel someone kind of like, like on the ground. And, and I felt like they've kind of come to this reality and this moment I actually will create separation. So I will leave. I will leave the dungeon room, I will leave the space and allow them to kind of have a moment on their own. And I say the same thing every time.

00:12:46:10 - 00:13:05:20
Speaker 2
I want to leave you for a moment in your own energy, take several deep breaths and take your time. Come back to me when you're ready. And so they will come meet me and said other place. And when they meet me in this new place, whether it's a different room or a different space in the same room, we are out of the scene, but still in a light dynamic.

00:13:05:21 - 00:13:13:23
Speaker 2
And so I'm still holding them. But I'm no longer the Dom. Now I'm the Dom. How's it going?

00:13:14:01 - 00:13:14:15
Speaker 4
Yeah.

00:13:14:17 - 00:13:15:08
Speaker 3
I like that.

00:13:15:09 - 00:13:39:01
Speaker 2
Water and a little bite of some food if I'm in my home dungeon space, a little chocolate, a little berry, a little sugar will also help ground someone's body and kind of pull them again into the present moment. And I will sit and talk with people for a few minutes. I try not to do any deep processing right after the scene.

00:13:39:02 - 00:13:39:10
Speaker 4
Yeah.

00:13:39:11 - 00:13:55:00
Speaker 2
Yeah, it's it's more of a time to give any immediate frames of how you're feeling, present moment stuff. And then if someone does really want to debrief, I say I'll debrief with you in 48 hours. And so once you've had two sleeps, two.

00:13:55:01 - 00:13:57:11
Speaker 3
Sleep need to integrate. Yeah.

00:13:57:14 - 00:14:17:21
Speaker 2
Sometimes things can go off the rails by debriefing. After seeing if someone is still in process, they're still in the experience and they they cling on to something that happened and it can actually become disruptive to the process. So we land the plane and then we roll them off into the rest of their day.

00:14:17:22 - 00:14:20:04
Speaker 3
I like to change lighting. You know, if you change.

00:14:20:04 - 00:14:20:17
Speaker 4
It.

00:14:20:19 - 00:14:23:19
Speaker 3
You know, you change the lighting and they start to shift.

00:14:23:20 - 00:14:26:17
Speaker 4
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:14:26:19 - 00:14:51:23
Speaker 1
You both just touched on something so important that play the psychology of imagination is not simply contained to that scene itself, that our experience continues to metabolize even after the wind down in the days after it's. And it. Did that happen? Did I experience that and integrating that experience into the psyche. And so that's brilliant in 48 hours.

00:14:52:00 - 00:14:54:12
Speaker 4
Yeah. No two sleeps sleeps.

00:14:54:14 - 00:15:22:08
Speaker 2
And I have my clients send me an email 3 to 5 sentences after every scene just giving their reflections. So that's another method of digesting the scene that helps them kind of like process the experience in their own minds. What we don't want is for someone to leave the room feeling amazing, but then not integrated at all, or feeling disrupted in some way and not integrated.

00:15:22:09 - 00:15:29:12
Speaker 2
It's the integration, even though we're not necessarily managing. It does need to happen and so we encourage it.

00:15:29:15 - 00:15:33:22
Speaker 1
Absolutely. Integration is oh, if only young could be.

00:15:33:22 - 00:15:36:18
Speaker 4
Here listening to this now.

00:15:36:20 - 00:15:42:05
Speaker 1
Well, goddess Victoria, mistress Madeline, this has been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so.

00:15:42:05 - 00:15:42:22
Speaker 4
Much.

00:15:43:00 - 00:15:51:02
Speaker 1
For hosting this conversation to our wonderful live audience. And with that, we have concluded the psychology of King. Thank you for joining us.